Padgate-Warrington East Chess Club Forum

Oldie · by **Oldie** on Mon Oct 05, 2009 11:12 am

When you consider the disincentives for playing the long game (e.g. having to go to your "away" venue every time), it is suprising that in this instance so many chose this option. Perhaps they prefer this to the arguements that can arise when trying to decide a game under the 2 minute rule, when no independent arbiter is present?

PaulTalbot · by **PaulTalbot** on Tue Oct 06, 2009 9:00 am

Oh come off it! How many time have you utilised the 2 minute rule or had your opponent ask for it in your life? I know I have it has only happened for me once (and that game was given against me even though my opponent WAS making time wasting moves [lots of pointless checks] and I could have definitely drawn the game if I had had more time). So the 2 minute rule is not something that weighs heavily on people's minds.

The reasons most people are against the long game are:
1. Adjournments
2. People working out continuations for adjourned games on fritz
3. The fact that adjourned games are often not finished i.e. draws agreed over the phone
4. It can sometimes mean a late night because you play on and on to try to avoid an adjournment.

Solve those problems and you will go some way to getting rid of the opposition to the long game.

Oldie · by **Oldie** on Wed Oct 07, 2009 3:41 pm

Here we go again :roll:

; complaining if you have to adjourn, complaining if you have to play on.

So the 2 minute rule is not something that weighs heavily on people's minds.

Many people are not even aware of the 2 minute rule and even if they are, do not bother trying to claim under it for the very reason you quoted; the chances of getting a favourable decision are minute. The Clock Rules O.K.! I have had 4 tries, result 3 losses on time. The only draw was a pawn and opposite colour bishops ending, a pawn down, and agreed reluctantly after prolonged discussion. In one of the losses I was a piece up. The Clock Rules O.K.

PaulTalbot · by **PaulTalbot** on Thu Oct 08, 2009 6:22 am

Oldie wrote: The Clock Rules O.K.

Exactly! I'd rather accept that I've lost within the confines of the rules of the game i.e. the time allowed for a game, than have to go to all the trouble of arranging another meeting and have to play someone who has memorised a load of different variations assisted by the best players from his club & Fritz. If I play this person on the night then we both know that we have 3 hours to complete the match in, and if one of us steps outside this allotment then we lose, but at least we lose within the rules. When he goes home and asks Fritz and asks his friends for help as far as I'm concerned he's stepped outside the rules, he's conferred with someone else & therefore he's cheated me, but he will get away with it. I want to play people fairly, I don't want to be cheated. I know you can say that I can look the position up on Fritz as well, but then I'm a cheat too; and whats the point. If we're going to do that why not just arrange a game between computers?

Oldie · by **Oldie** on Thu Oct 08, 2009 11:46 am

PaulTalbot wrote: I could have definitely drawn the game if I had had more time

But you didn't feel cheated, angry or annoyed?!
The mere fact that the 2 minute rule exists shows the attitude of the "boy racers", if we move fast enough in a drawish (or even losing) game we can win. The ultimate absurdity of the rule is that it goes back to adjudication, not only of the position, but of the intentions and capabilities of the players.
I have a brilliant idea, to make things fairer, lets play 2 games against the same opponent each night, one with the white pieces and one with black. That way we can reduce the amount of travelling (very green!) and we just reverse the fixtures each year.
I think that we will have to agree to differ as to the relative importance of the position on the board and the time on the clock (especially with mechanical ones).

PaulTalbot · by **PaulTalbot** on Thu Oct 08, 2009 4:44 pm

I think that at the end of the day it comes down to personal preference. I prefer to take the risk that I might lose on time and you prefer to take the risk that you might lose to someone because they've memorised Fritz.

Why then is your personal preference more important than mine, in that, if you chose the long game I have to go along with it? That is what I think is most wrong. Especially as that choice has the potential to cause the most disruption and inconvenience.

My choice won't disrupt your life. You may feel 'put out' or a little aggrieved if the game goes against you but your life won't be disrupted. Your choice may take me away from my family for a full night, or cause me to lose money if I have to keep a night free and not work. It may also disrupt my whole club if my team can't play a re-arranged match on a particular night because 1 team member has to play an adjourned game on that night (as has happened already this season).

That is why the current system is so unfair as it favours some people over and above others.

Damian · by **Damian** on Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:51 pm

Ok for something fresh and topical given our last game:

We just had a game adjourned v Winwick. The only days our player can resume are at weekends due to his work (he could only play this match this week due to having this week off work)

Are long game players happy for weekend dates to be given as a resumption date? Knowing that if you can't play within 28 days the game is defaulted?

It's interesting, weekends are not ideal i know but our guy really can't do anything during the week

Oldie · by **Oldie** on Sun Oct 11, 2009 3:05 pm

I entirely agree that the player insisting on the long game should make every effort to accomodate his opponent, but don't forget that he is generally having to go to his opponent's choice of venue.
I have repeatedly requested statistics for the number of games adjourned and those actually played out, and hopefully these will be available for the current season. Paul makes a big thing out of the 5 games v Winnick being long games; no one has ever remarked on the number of occasions when 5 out of 6 games are fixed finish and, of course, all the Kalmar games are of this format!
Reference is always made to the finishing time of games but my experince so far this season (as previously), is that for the start time, setting up boards and clocks (defaulted to 90 minutes each!) at 7.30 p.m. onwards is near enough. Surely there is no excuse for home team players to be arriving after the official start time?

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